Sony "InfoLITHIUM" Battery Packs

If your Sony unit uses the "InfoLITHIUM" battery packs and the manual says "Your camcorder operates only with the 'InfoLITHIUM' battery pack" (or words to that effect) then that most likely means what it says.

If you try an after market battery and your camera shuts off after a short time the display says "For InfoLITHIUM only." that also pretty much says what it means.

Since Lithium Ion batteries (Li-Ion) can be sensitive to charging, discharging and temperature effects it appears to me that Sony has included an integrated circuit to monitor battery conditions and has trademarked the packs as "InfoLITHIUM" and the battery pack communicates with the camera. I have seen claims that Li-Ion packs have exploded which I could not verify but they can create enough intense heat to catch on fire which is probably just as bad.

There are some third party batteries which claim to be "InfoLITHIUM" compatible. I do not know how compatible they are.

Rich

Poncho I have read quite a number of posts especially coming from the Sony area.

I wont say I know much about these things but would it not make sense to only use the type of battery that the Company indicates is for the use of the camera. I thought that I have noticed that in some of the generic batteries they have different capacities then the required Sony Battery I need in my HC-40.

Also taking the battery out of the equation and this I guess can be looked at differently are the spikes that you may get from your electrical company. Especially in the summer months with lightning and thunderstorms.

This is only my 2 cents and I would like to get other opinions of this. Thanks

It becomes a matter of cost. If you price Sony batteries and generic batteries there can be a big difference. Some people claim the some of the generics work well for them.

But it is not as simple as NiCad batteries.


Rich

Hello all. Here's my experience of what happened with a generic brand of battery that I purchased for my Sony DCR-TRV720.

I purchased two new generic batteries from eBay, and the description on the eBay site included my brand of camcorder (DCR-TRV720) in its compatibility chart. The brand name on the battery packages says: "DIGITAL Camcorder Battery," "FOR NP-F960". NP-F960 is the high-end model of Sony's battery line, which has a 12-hour battery life (but costs three times as much as the generic brand).

I placed one of the new batteries in my camcorder when I got home (which I'll call Battery #1), and turned the camcorder on. It told me the battery had a life of about 550 minutes or something like that, so after about a minute of filming, I plugged in the camcorder charger to see how high the charge would go. About a day or so later I turned the camcorder on, and after about 10 seconds a blue screen appeared with the following message: "FOR 'InfoLITHIUM' BATTERY ONLY". This message was popping up at the time that the battery life "MIN" indicator would normally pop up. It was immediately pretty clear that the my camcorder didn't like this generic battery. I assume that it was reporting this message when it was trying to communicate with the battery about remaining battery life, etc.

This is where things got a bit odd. After flicking the camcorder on a few times and getting the error message each time, the message finally stopped at one point. To see if it was just a fluke, I turned off the camcorder and turned it back on, and the battery was still working fine. I did this a bunch more times, and it seemed to be working with out any problems.

Now things get very strange. I took the other identical generic camcorder battery I bought (which I'll call Battery #2) and put it in the camcorder. When I turned the camcorder on, I got the error message again. I kept turning the camcorder on again and again, occasionally waiting a bit longer to turn it on, and still I kept getting the message. So I tried putting Battery # 1 back in, and it worked just fine, even after switching it on and off a few times. I'd put Battery # 2 back in, and again with the error message. I switched batteries a few times, just to make sure that it wasn't a coincidence, but concluded that Battery # 1 is definitely working (for now) and Battery # 2 is not.

That being said, I hadn't yet charged Battery # 2 before using it. However, when I initially put the battery in, it did give me an indication of well over 700 min. And even if it were a matter of Battery #2 just not having a sufficient charge and giving a false reading about the minutes, how come Battery #1 was initially giving me the problem when I started using it after a full day of charging?

This all just happened tonight, so I don't know whether or not I'm going to have a happy ending to all this. I'm leaving for a one-week vacation tomorrow, and will be taking the two generic batteries with me.

Will Battery #1 continue to work? Will the problem return after its next recharge?

Will Battery #2 ever work? Perhaps after I fully charge it, it might begin to work as Battery #1 did.

To be honest, I will likely go out and purchase a lower-life Sony brand battery in case my generic batteries fail during vacation. From my experience so far, I would recommend to people that you shell out a bit more money and buy the brand recommended by your camcorder manufacturer's manual. I wouldn't necessarily recommend following "camcorder compatibility charts" that accompany the sale of generic batteries, as they're not necessarily accurate.

That being said, I'll try to remember to come back to this forum when I get back from my vacation so I can post the results of my vigorous testing with the generic batteries over the next week. I'm still holding out hope that the generic batteries might somehow work out.

Sorry for the verbose post. I just figured that if I posted as much details as possible, someone's analytical mind might be able to piece together how one of two identical generic camcorder batteries could seemingly "learn" to fool my Sony camcorder into thinking that it was an "InfoLITHIUM" battery.

Hi guys,

lanfisher, I know you posted a long time ago but hopefully you'll get an email when I post this reply. I am having the exact same problem as you did but with my Sony DSC-T7 digital camera, I bought two generics from ebay but I can't get either of them to beat the infolithium system, despite the fact they were advertised for my camera and as infolithium battery packs!

How did things turn out for you?

I have an old Sony and three original Sony 1350mA InfoLithium batteries since 1996-97, still working.
Some days ago I saw a generic same sized battery at about the same price I paid for an original battery ten years ago, and I really don't know if it could work well.
Maybe the chip inside InfoLithium is really important, and maybe also a way to link a customer to a TM...
Bye
olonoise

The problem is, the seller on Ebay is a company who sells hundreds of electronic goods each day, and this particular auction claims they are specifically for my camera Sony DSC-T7 and have infoLITHIUM techonology. That's what annoys me, but anyway, I've ordered a genuine one now for double the cost of what I bought two generics including the p&p from USA

Just curious if these are a viable canidate for the Sony HDR-HC1:
http://www.atbatt.com/camcorder-batteries/b/Sony/m/HDR-HC1.asp

I have an old Sony and three original Sony 1350mA InfoLithium batteries since 1996-97, still working.
Some days ago I saw a generic same sized battery at about the same price I paid for an original battery ten years ago, and I really don't know if it could work well.
Maybe the chip inside InfoLithium is really important, and maybe also a way to link a customer to a TM...
Bye
olonoise

Yeah, the chip inside is really important - to Sony. Any 'legal' Lithium ion battery pack should contain a cut-out to prevent serious overcharge or over-temperature (as they are prone to shoot out flames if mistreated). But, this is NOT a funtion of the Sony chip if prevents use during normal discharge.

I had the use of a PC1E back in 1999 and really felt that the batteries were over-priced. So I set to work to build a faker that would let me use normal NiCads to drive the camera. Took a while, but it worked fine in the end. It's even more use now there are high-powered 'AA' NiMH units with 2500mAH capacity at low-low prices.

Don't get me wrong; I love Sony's products. The quality, reliability and functionality are great. I just detest the way they try to lock you in.

bluestax.

I have a HVR-Z1U and I have one genuine NP-F570 and 4 x generic NP-F960 / 970. The 960 are rated at 5600 mAh and give me around 355 minutes and the 970 rated at 6100 mAh give me 560 minutes. They were about the same price off Ebay. The 960 came from an Ebay seller in Arcadia, CA and the 970 from a seller in New York.

Here's something I posted last year concerning my Ebay battery buying experience Generic batteries off Ebay Warning (http://www.camcorderinfo.com/bbs/t119931.html)

Since then my 4 batteries have worked perfectly, but I would definitely recommend getting the NP-F970.

With either Sony infolithium batteries or substittute ones, it's advisable to initially run them down to the point of camera shut-off then fully charge them. That's your best shot at getting all the electronic controls on the same page.

--
Fred

So I set to work to build a faker that would let me use normal NiCads to drive the camera. Took a while, but it worked fine in the end. It's even more use now there are high-powered 'AA' NiMH units with 2500mAH capacity at low-low prices.

Hi bluestax,
How did you build the faker?
Thanks

Hello all. Here's my experience of what happened with a generic brand of battery that I purchased for my Sony DCR-TRV720.

I purchased two new generic batteries from eBay, and the description on the eBay site included my brand of camcorder (DCR-TRV720) in its compatibility chart. The brand name on the battery packages says: "DIGITAL Camcorder Battery," "FOR NP-F960". NP-F960 is the high-end model of Sony's battery line, which has a 12-hour battery life (but costs three times as much as the generic brand).

I placed one of the new batteries in my camcorder when I got home (which I'll call Battery #1), and turned the camcorder on. It told me the battery had a life of about 550 minutes or something like that, so after about a minute of filming, I plugged in the camcorder charger to see how high the charge would go. About a day or so later I turned the camcorder on, and after about 10 seconds a blue screen appeared with the following message: "FOR 'InfoLITHIUM' BATTERY ONLY". This message was popping up at the time that the battery life "MIN" indicator would normally pop up. It was immediately pretty clear that the my camcorder didn't like this generic battery. I assume that it was reporting this message when it was trying to communicate with the battery about remaining battery life, etc.

This is where things got a bit odd. After flicking the camcorder on a few times and getting the error message each time, the message finally stopped at one point. To see if it was just a fluke, I turned off the camcorder and turned it back on, and the battery was still working fine. I did this a bunch more times, and it seemed to be working with out any problems.

Now things get very strange. I took the other identical generic camcorder battery I bought (which I'll call Battery #2) and put it in the camcorder. When I turned the camcorder on, I got the error message again. I kept turning the camcorder on again and again, occasionally waiting a bit longer to turn it on, and still I kept getting the message. So I tried putting Battery # 1 back in, and it worked just fine, even after switching it on and off a few times. I'd put Battery # 2 back in, and again with the error message. I switched batteries a few times, just to make sure that it wasn't a coincidence, but concluded that Battery # 1 is definitely working (for now) and Battery # 2 is not.

That being said, I hadn't yet charged Battery # 2 before using it. However, when I initially put the battery in, it did give me an indication of well over 700 min. And even if it were a matter of Battery #2 just not having a sufficient charge and giving a false reading about the minutes, how come Battery #1 was initially giving me the problem when I started using it after a full day of charging?

This all just happened tonight, so I don't know whether or not I'm going to have a happy ending to all this. I'm leaving for a one-week vacation tomorrow, and will be taking the two generic batteries with me.

Will Battery #1 continue to work? Will the problem return after its next recharge?

Will Battery #2 ever work? Perhaps after I fully charge it, it might begin to work as Battery #1 did.

To be honest, I will likely go out and purchase a lower-life Sony brand battery in case my generic batteries fail during vacation. From my experience so far, I would recommend to people that you shell out a bit more money and buy the brand recommended by your camcorder manufacturer's manual. I wouldn't necessarily recommend following "camcorder compatibility charts" that accompany the sale of generic batteries, as they're not necessarily accurate.

That being said, I'll try to remember to come back to this forum when I get back from my vacation so I can post the results of my vigorous testing with the generic batteries over the next week. I'm still holding out hope that the generic batteries might somehow work out.

Sorry for the verbose post. I just figured that if I posted as much details as possible, someone's analytical mind might be able to piece together how one of two identical generic camcorder batteries could seemingly "learn" to fool my Sony camcorder into thinking that it was an "InfoLITHIUM" battery.


Okay... my last post was April 29, 2005 and I said I would come back to this thread eventually. It's now June 13, 2006, and my generic battery still works! In fact, both of them work now. I still get the error message once in a blue moon, but it goes away after powering off the camcorder a couple of times. It's still enough of a pain in the arse that I will likely buy a non-Sony next time I go camcorder shopping. I think this business of having to buy Sony batteries is more of a cash grab than it is a safety policy.

Okay... my last post was April 29, 2005 and I said I would come back to this thread eventually. It's now June 13, 2006, and my generic battery still works! In fact, both of them work now. I still get the error message once in a blue moon, but it goes away after powering off the camcorder a couple of times. It's still enough of a pain in the arse that I will likely buy a non-Sony next time I go camcorder shopping. I think this business of having to buy Sony batteries is more of a cash grab than it is a safety policy.

I have just purchased a Sony hc3 video camera. Itried to use the Inca infotech, infolithium batteries that work fine in my Sony hc30 video camera however I get the "use infolithium" message from the new camera. I tried powering off/on a number of times but no success.
Is this a restrictive trade practice by Sony? They have obviousy added new circuits in the new cameras.
Has anyone bought generic batteries that work with the Sony hc3 video camera?


Jeff

Is this a restrictive trade practice by Sony?I do not believe so.



Rich

It's not a LiIon issue... practically everything uses LiIon batteries now and only Sony (as far as I know) takes ones with weird proprietary circuitry that verifies the manufacturer.

Do any of the other manufacturers do this? I just bought a DVD405 and I am a little ticked about the battery situation... enough that I might return it. I'm not going to be buying any $100 batteries any time soon. I'm also pretty disappointed that there is no way to charge the battery outside the camera without spending another $50 on a charger. Just overcoming those two faults would add on 25% of the price of the camcorder.

It's not a LiIon issue... practically everything uses LiIon batteries now and only Sony (as far as I know) takes ones with weird proprietary circuitry that verifies the manufacturer.

Do any of the other manufacturers do this?
All the manufacturers have protective circuits within the battery pack. Sony appears to do more than protection it also monitors battery consumption for their battery remaining feature, the battery pack and the camcorder communicate with each other.

I would not call it weird proprietary circuitry since there are no standards that I am aware of for monitoring the charge, discharge and many times battery temperature. Each manufacturer uses their own standard.


I just bought a DVD405 and I am a little ticked about the battery situation... enough that I might return it. I'm not going to be buying any $100 batteries any time soon.
There are some third party batteries that some people claim work with their Sony's. I have been using a TARGUS TG-FP50 680mAh 7.2V Lithium-Ion Battery in my Sony DCR-HC40 for almost a year. It was about $25 at newegg.com. Some people have also claimed than Lenmar batteries work in their Sony camcorder. My own opinion is that some people buy the cheapest third party battery they can which might be of questionable quality to begin with.

The Sony battery issue has discussed for several years. This thread will be two years old in two days.



Rich

All the manufacturers have protective circuits within the battery pack.
Sure, they do, but they don't have any checks to see what brand of battery is present. I have spare $5 batteries for my Canon that work fine. Some of these cheapos have better overcharge and short circuit protection than others, but they work.

I would not call it weird proprietary circuitry since there are no standards that I am aware of for monitoring the charge, discharge and many times battery temperature. Each manufacturer uses their own standard.
The part where the camcorder talks to the battery to find out if it is a legit Sony battery would fall into the "weird" category. There are no standards, but as far as I know, no other manufacturer does this part.

Sony appears to do more than protection
I'm not so trusting of Sony in this regard. It seems to me it is much more likely that they do it for the same reason they use memory stick memory. I wouldn't feel any safer using a Sony battery than a Canon or Panasonic battery... in fact, those exploding dell laptop batteries that are being recalled were manufactured by Sony.

There are some third party batteries that some people claim work with their Sony's. I have been using a TARGUS TG-FP50 680mAh 7.2V Lithium-Ion Battery in my Sony DCR-HC40 for almost a year. It was about $25 at newegg.com. Some people have also claimed than Lenmar batteries work in their Sony camcorder. My own opinion is that some people buy the cheapest third party battery they can which might be of questionable quality to begin with.
I was really hoping there would be some that work... but I've become pretty discouraged by what I've found on other threads... it sounds like changes were made recently (between the 403 and the 405 models) to filter out more (all?) of these third party batteries. It's not something you really want to take a chance on and then get that dreaded message, either.

I wouldn't feel any safer using a Sony battery than a Canon or Panasonic battery... in fact, those exploding dell laptop batteries that are being recalled were manufactured by Sony.In fact none of them "exploded". Do you have any verifiable reliable data which describes Lithium Ion batteries exploding?

Maybe you should read this entire thread:
http://www.camcorderinfo.com/bbs/t123750.html




Rich

Yes... my mistake... explode would not be the right word... If any did explode it probably would've been after they burst into flames. Though one did apparently cause a truck to explode (http://www.iht.com/articles/2006/08/14/technology/web.0815battery.php) when it burst into flames.

"a Dell notebook in the cab of a pickup parked alongside Lake Mead in Nevada caught fire, igniting ammunition in the glove box and then the gas tanks. The truck exploded. "A few minutes later..."

Duh, I wonder if the ammunition in the glove box contributed to the explosion...


I still have a 1984 GMC pickup truck with the dual tanks which I purchased new. It is the truck with "the exploding gas tanks". I still have not settled on the class action suit which started in the 90's. The truck has not blown up yet.

One out of eight fire deaths results from motor vehicle fires.

One in every four fire department responses is to a vehicle fire. This does not include the tens of thousands of responses to vehicle accident sites.

How many houses have blown up due to propane gas leaks.

Over 42,000 people die each year from vehicle crashes...

Yes, Lithium Ion batteries can be dangerous, but I think there are bigger threats in life to worry about.



Rich

Regarding batteries, are batteries from Energizer any good since Energizer is a reputable company. Assuming one uses OEM Sony batteries, are there any disadvantages to using a Energizer charger versus a Sony OEM one since I noticed the Sony OEM is AC only while the Energizer one works with different batteries and also can run on both AC and DC. I know other brands are not as well known but Energizer and Eveready before that are long established companies whose been making batteries for longer than even Sony existed as a company.

Regarding batteries, are batteries from Energizer any good since Energizer is a reputable company. Assuming one uses OEM Sony batteries, are there any disadvantages to using a Energizer charger versus a Sony OEM one since I noticed the Sony OEM is AC only while the Energizer one works with different batteries and also can run on both AC and DC. I know other brands are not as well known but Energizer and Eveready before that are long established companies whose been making batteries for longer than even Sony existed as a company.I have no experience with the Energizer batteries which claim to work with the Sony's but you might read this thread: Energizer ER-C557 battery and Sony SR100
http://www.camcorderinfo.com/bbs/t129940.html


Rich

I read that thread yesterday and that was the reason I'm going to buy a Genuine Sony FP90 anyways since the Energizer is still 100mAh less in the rating than OEM. I was more interested in the chargers since Energizer makes a charger that will charge a boatload of batteries and is supposedly a faster charger while the Sony travel charger takes over 8 hours to reach full capacity on the FP90.

So I'm on my 4th one... or my second newly purchased genuine Infolithium ($48 each) and the camcorder (tv 340 digital8 from about 2001) still sporratically reports the "sony inflLithium only" eror. I've found that my best shot at being able to take video is to turn the camera on, and SLOOOWLY push the battery into position, leaving it UNLATCHED. The contacts all look fine, I think I've determined that ONE of the 3 contacts is for DATA.

That aside, I canNOT have this thing crap out next week. It mounts in my car and the car bounces around the track so my trick won't work. Here is my real question:

I think I may have a way around this..

Anyone ever applied a DC source directly to the transformer pack (where the rectification etc simply would not have to do work), or run a DC dource into the camera's transformer input via a matching plug? I'm about ready to try BOTH methods.. and if it blows up who cares... stupid thing.

I'll ask which camcorder I should by in another topic if it comes to that.

TIA!