I have a Sony HandyCam DCR-TRV250 that is 4-5 years old and has broken for the second time. The camera itself initially cost only $400 and has been repaired once for between $100-$200. I'm being quoted a similar $200 for the repairs this time and am figuring it would be easier to get a newer updated camera instead. I already have extra batteries and Hi8/Digital8 tapes that I want to continue to use, so I want to stay with the same type of camera but am getting very confused by the different series and what ones will play older tapes, etc. Can someone suggest which camera would be similar to the 250?

Your camcorder (DCR-TRV250) records in the Digitial8 format, so any video recorded with that camcorder should play back on any Digital8 camcorder.

They are not making any new Digital8 camcorders and sony does not list any units on their web site. The do list the GV-D200 Digital8® Video Walkman™ VCR:

http://www.sonystyle.com/webapp/wcs...categoryId=4054

If I were you, I would try to get out of the Digital8 format. That is what I am doing.


Rich

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I agree with Rich. Sony abandoned the Digital8 format 2 or 3 years ago. You will only be able to find used ones on eBay, Pawn shops and garage sales. It is always risky buying used camcorders but some do it and find good deals. Others get burned by someone selling defective junk.

I bought 4 Digital8 camcorders in the 1999-2000 time frame and they are all still working. I don't ever plan to change formats but I am old and don't have a lot of years left. If you are young (under 60) it is time to move on to a different format. Walmart or Walgreen's can probably transfer your existing D8 tapes to DVD for you. I think Walgreen's had an ad this week for 2 tapes to DVD for $20 or maybe it was $30?

All companies are caught up in the race to make smaller and cheaper camcorders. Digital8 lost out because they couldn't make it any smaller or cheaper. Todays Canon HV20 is the only current camcorder I would even consider.

Dave

Doesn't Digital8 use FireWire just like MiniDV? In this case anyone who already has Digital8 camcorder can backup tapes himself. DVD blanks are cheap, 20-50c for a single-layer disk, you will need 2-3 disks per cassette.
I don't think Digital8 has lost, I think Sony killed it. I don't see any benefits of MiniDV over Digital8, the difference in cassette size is negligible. Even more, MiniDV is a worse format with narrower tracks and slower tape speed. The real successor to Digital8 in DV world was DVCam. I don't know why Sony could not push Digital8 as a standard, but could push MiniDV. Just yet another cassette format, just yet another trick to sell the same stuff again and again.
I would not choose a tape-based format in 2008. HV20 is a good camcorder feature-wise, but it basically sees its second year without major modifications (which may be a good thing, pro cameras are produced for several years without major changes). Same thing with HC7. Panasonic just announced an SD-card based replacement for DVX100. JVC pushes HDDs and memory cards. Canon pushes memory cards. Sony EX uses SxS memory cards. HVX200 uses P2 memory cards. D-VHS never caught up, the main battle was fought between two optical disk-based formats, and Blu-Ray seems to have won.

Tapes are getting obsolete FAST. Sure, MiniDV and HDV got much more popular than Digital8, but I would not want to get myself into situation in 10 years when I need a tape or -- worse! -- a deck to read my tapes, and there are none. Cards are easier, as long as you have a reader, and card readers do not break because their heads are clogged. Even simpler with optical disks: an ultra-modern Blu-Ray disk drive can read regular DVDs and CDs, the best backward compatibility ever for storage devices, you can stick a 25-year old CD into Blu-Ray drive and it will read it.

As long as optical disks will be cheaper per gigabyte than memory cards, they will remain media of choice for archiving and long-term storage, but I believe that in 10 years disks will go away too. Memory cards are getting cheap, small in size and can hold a lot.

P.S. If HD is not important, it may make sense to swith to regular MiniDV. cheap entry-level camcorders cost about $200, just buy one and stash it somewhere for future use as a deck. HDV camcorders are too expensive for a spare deck, imho.

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Michael, Canon Elura User Pages

Did you read the original post? He said his only D8 camcorder was BROKEN. How is he going to burn DVD's if he can't play his tapes?

What is the difference between "lost out" and "killed it"? To me they mean the exact same thing. Did anybody say that MiniDV was better than Digital8"? If there is an advantage for MiniDV, it is that you can still buy those camcorders. New Digital8 camcorders have been gone for a couple of years.

Nonsense....MiniDV tapes will be available for at least another 10 years, probably for as long as any of the millions of MiniDV camcorders are still working and their owners are buying tapes. The HV20 is a cheap camcorder that works better in low light than anything else in it's price range. The future is high definition and the HV20 is the best way to transition to HD for the future.

Sorry jockey but when you pick apart everything I say, I have to respond. You and I don't agree on anything so far. But that is what forums are all about. Everyone is entitled to their opinion.

Dave

I totally agree that HD is the future, which is why I think that the HG10 is a better option than the HV20. It has the same optics as the HV20, and it is tapeless. Connect it to a computer and back it up on any media you want. If tapes disappear tomorrow, you will still be able to shoot video with the HG10.

I keep some 20-year old computer programs, I first stored them on 5.25" disks, then I backed them up to 3.5" disks, then I copied them to CDs, then I copied all this stuff to one DVD. It is the same data, and I don't care that I cannot find a 5.25" floppy disk drive anymore.

This argument is not about video, it is about storage solutions for digital data.

Seems that many, including you, value the "instant backup" feature of tapes. This is surely a good property of tapes, but I just don't like handling tapes, I started to dislike them when I first worked with a mainframe reel-to-reel tape drive, then I really started hating tape when I was using a 60MB tape streamer. Then our system administrator lost 4GB worth of data because a tape failed to restore. At this time I finally lost faith in tapes.

I somewhat liked my VHS tape recorder, mainly because it had "flying heads" and I could forward/rewind/erase/pause without getting out of recording mode, so I was always getting clean TV recordings with no commercials and without visible cuts. This time has passed. I don't want to worry about dropouts or dust or humidity (not that HDD-based cameras are invincible to dust or humidity) and I don't want to get locked into a specific -- and probably dying -- standard. No tapes for me anymore.
I think we agreed on that MiniDV is no better than Digital8

P.S. This is an interesting article: http://www.firstmonday.org/Issues/issue12_7/marcum/

Seems like I am using #2 and #3, I also believe that I am using #1

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Michael, Canon Elura User Pages

Having used a 740 since I bought it new 2002 (?) I can honestly say I have not experienced any dropouts or loss of sound, something that HAS happened on more than one occasion since using my (new) GS500 for about one year.

Let the record also show I mixed brands of tape (Sony, Fuji, JVC) without any problems either, something I haven't even tried after all that I've read about mini DV and it's "sensitivity."

check out ebay for camcorders. id recommend buying i from a person whos selling it (instead of a pawn shop) as itll probably be in better shape. i got a dcr-trv120 which was the best year of the camcorders for $150

You guys totally got off-track. I don't care about the debate of the different formats and whether one lost or was killed and why. I just want to figure out the progression of Sony's Digital 8 camcorders so I don't replace the one I have with one that won't play my existing tapes. Please don't waste time advising or convincing me to another format. I know what I want, and I just want help determing which ones are newer/better within the digital8/hi8 format.

I'm looking at places like Amazon and eBay and such for my purchase, but want to figure out how the different lines compare. For example I see the following:

DCR-TRVxxx (xxx = 103, 140, 260, 330, 340, 460, 520, 350, etc) -
Is there any naming convention like the highest number is the newest; or is it within the series by hundreds....ie the 260 is better than the 340 because of the second digit, not the first?

I also see CCD-TRV138 and that I see in stores like Best Buy, Circuit City, Target, etc. The guy at SonyStyle did say that he recognized that as the most recent Digital8 they had. This was the one I planned on getting, then I read up on it and wasn't so sure if it was comparable/compatible or not.

Nevermind. I found the answers I was looking for, I think. There is an excel spreadsheet stickied on this board with tons and tons of info on every DCR-xxx Sony made. I should be able to use that to find what I am looking for online.

Though it would be a whole lot easier to buy the CCD-TRV138 currently in stores if it would work with my existing tapes....

The CCD-TRV138 is a Hi8 camcorder. It will not play back Digital8 video (which can be recorder on tape cassettes marked Hi8).

The last Digital8 camcorders made are the DCR-TRV460 and 480. Which you may be able to find easily.



Rich

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Thanks Rich. Guess I'll have to find and order one online, then. I had assumed that since it took the same tapes that it was the latest and greatest model of what I had. Glad I didn't just blindly pick it up and that my dad didn't receive the info on it that I had sent him for my Christmas wishlist, since it apparently isn't the one I want after all.

So I think I've narrowed it down to the 460 or 350, but the 280 is tempting as well. I've read conflicting info on it, though and can't tell whether it will play my tapes or not.

I would trust the Sony Digital 8 Features Excel Spreadsheet which you discovered earlier. I have never seen anyone ever find an error in it.



Rich

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Thanks again, Rich. It's funny...I really don't need the advanced features of a model like the 460, but it seems to be available for better pricing than some of the "lower-end" models...even a match to my 250 is potentially more expensive. I should ignore the ones that have an E added on to the model # and followed by 'PAL', correct?

I think I'm finally grasping the Hi8/Digital8 differences. It was confusing me that they both use the same cassettes, but I understand now that it is the camera that they are recorded on that is the important factor. And the fact that the same manual covers cameras that do each is very frustrating as well. This confused me from day 1 when my husband gave me the 250 for Christmas a few years ago.

You're saying that as long as the section of the excel spreadsheet that references supported media formats match my existing camera I should be ok on my old tapes being readable, right? And, for example, I should not worry that I read somewhere (in either a writeup or a consumer comment) that the 280 was not 'backward compatible' to playing earlier tapes...?

Specifically I am only looking at the 7 DCR-TRVxxx models that came out in the 2 years after my 250 came out. They all are marked P/R for both Digital 8 modes, just like my 250, but the 460 and 480 also can playback the two Hi8 modes if I am understanding the spreadsheet correctly. It looks, from the spreadsheet, that the 260, 265 and 280 were practically identical to the 250 except for the years that they were made and a couple of very small differences

If you bought your camcorder in the US, it is most likely NTSC (It is not PAL and you do not want any PAL unit).

You have the DCR-TRV250 which is a Digital8 model.

It only records in the Digital8 format.

It will only play the Digital8 format.

The above is from page 14 of the TRV250 manual.

So if all your tapes were recorded on the TRV250, then you have to get a Digital8 model. Any Digital8 model, regardless of the year or the features is designed to play your videos created on the TRV250.

The DCR-TRV280 is a Digital8 model and would work to play back your tapes.

The DCR-TRV150 350 and 351 are Digital8 models and will work, they were made the same year as your trv250.

It appears you are reading the spreadsheet correctly.

I have the TRV460 and it plays back my 8mm and Hi8 recorded tapes as well as Digital8 recorded video.




Rich.

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