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  #1  
Old 05-09-2008, 08:41 PM
Pond Pond is offline
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HF10 - Questions for consideration

I am interested in getting the HF10 as a handy point and shoot camera. It seems to perform exceptionally well for its size. I have a few questions and I appreciate that you let me know your comments if you have the answer.



1) Is there a PAL and NTSC version for the HF10? If yes, will there be no 30p like the HV30? HV30 has 30p for the NTSC format only.

2) Assuming all other things being equal, HF10 with a resolution of 1920X1080 should look better when compared to HDV with only 1440x1080

3) Can you reduce the HF10’s recording resolution to 1440X1080 to extend the recording time?

4) With the HV30/20 test report, when the camera is switch to 24p, the picture quality improves dramatically in low-light environment. Is this the same for the HF10? If so, in low-light environment, with HF10 at 24p should look better than HV30 at normal frame rate (60i? not sure what this is), right?

5) Is there any edit function in the HF10? I want to know if HF10 allows you to perform some simple editing function like cut and join a clip without creating a separate file.

6) Archiving – what is your preferred method of archiving your video files? How much AVCHD video at HF10’s full resolution can be stored on a standard DVD? My guess it is about 20min so you need to have 2 DVDs for each hour of AVCHD video. Until blue-ray becomes more affordable, I don’t think storing AVCHD in DVD is a good idea.
Here is what I will do. I will use my HF10 to capture video at 1920x1080. I have a Sony HC3 (HDV 1440x1080) which can be used as a tape deck. Using a HDMI cable, can I transfer the video from HF10 at 1920x1080 to HC3 and record it at 1440x1080? If this works, then this is what I prefer but I have to sacrifice loosing some video quality. If HDMI cable doesn’t allow me to do this, then I will have to rely on editing software to down convert it to 1440x1080 for my HC3 to record it as tape.
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  #2  
Old 05-09-2008, 09:50 PM
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poncho poncho is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pond
1) Is there a PAL and NTSC version for the HF10? If yes, will there be no 30p like the HV30? HV30 has 30p for the NTSC format only.
The PAL version of the HF100 and HF10 has 25P and 50i options.

The NTSC version has 24p, 30p and 60i

I suggest you get the camcorder for the location you live in. That is just my opinion.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pond
2) Assuming all other things being equal, HF10 with a resolution of 1920X1080 should look better when compared to HDV with only 1440x1080
All things are not equal. Don't try that type of comparision. Look at valid test results and sample videos.

HDV is recorded in what is called anamorphic widescreen 1440 x 1080 and displayed 1920 x 1080. The technology is anamorphic pixels with a Pixel Aspect Ratio of 1.333:1.

Explained differently, it is seen as 1920 x 1080 squeezed to 1440 x 1080 then unsqeezed to 1920 x 1080 when viewed on a TV. Same principal that is used on standard "widescreen", 16:9 TV

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pond
3) Can you reduce the HF10’s recording resolution to 1440X1080 to extend the recording time?
There are four recording modes which affect the recording times.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pond
4) With the HV30/20 test report, when the camera is switch to 24p, the picture quality improves dramatically in low-light environment. Is this the same for the HF10? If so, in low-light environment, with HF10 at 24p should look better than HV30 at normal frame rate (60i? not sure what this is), right?
At 24P low light sensitivity increases because a slower shutter can be used. Again, don't start assuming performance based on different camcorders.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pond
5) Is there any edit function in the HF10?
I do not recall seeing any in the manual. I could have missed it

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pond
6) Archiving – what is your preferred method of archiving your video files? How much AVCHD video at HF10’s full resolution can be stored on a standard DVD? My guess it is about 20min so you need to have 2 DVDs for each hour of AVCHD video. Until blue-ray becomes more affordable, I don’t think storing AVCHD in DVD is a good idea.
Here is what I will do. I will use my HF10 to capture video at 1920x1080. I have a Sony HC3 (HDV 1440x1080) which can be used as a tape deck. Using a HDMI cable, can I transfer the video from HF10 at 1920x1080 to HC3 and record it at 1440x1080? If this works, then this is what I prefer but I have to sacrifice loosing some video quality. If HDMI cable doesn’t allow me to do this, then I will have to rely on editing software to down convert it to 1440x1080 for my HC3 to record it as tape.

I use tape based camcorders. I keep the tape. I make backups on external hard disk drives. I do not trust DVD's for archive.

The HV10 records in AVCHD, not in HDV. Sounds like you are trying t do a lot of extra work with some extra complications.




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  #3  
Old 05-09-2008, 09:56 PM
jockey jockey is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pond
Is there a PAL and NTSC version for the HF10?
PAL and NTSC are analog standards, this is a digital camera. 24p and 30p are for 60 Hz version, 25p is for 50 Hz version.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pond
Assuming all other things being equal, HF10 with a resolution of 1920X1080 should look better when compared to HDV with only 1440x1080
Not necessarily. Most HD cameras produce about 600 lw/ph regardless of frame size in pixels.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pond
Can you reduce the HF10’s recording resolution to 1440X1080 to extend the recording time?
17 Mbps mode is 1920x1080, 12 Mbps and lower bitrate modes are 1440x1080, just as you wish.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pond
With the HV30/20 test report, when the camera is switch to 24p, the picture quality improves dramatically in low-light environment. Is this the same for the HF10?
Have you read a review on this site?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pond
If so, in low-light environment, with HF10 at 24p should look better than HV30 at normal frame rate (60i? not sure what this is), right?
Don't know.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pond
Is there any edit function in the HF10? I want to know if HF10 allows you to perform some simple editing function like cut and join a clip without creating a separate file.
No.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pond
Archiving – what is your preferred method of archiving your video files?
I backup a complete 4GB card onto a DVD. Easy backup is the reason I don't use larger cards.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pond
How much AVCHD video at HF10’s full resolution can be stored on a standard DVD? My guess it is about 20min
You don't need to guess, you can calculate. Maximum bitrate is 17 Mbit/s.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pond
so you need to have 2 DVDs for each hour of AVCHD video.
20 mins per disk make two disks to store one hour? Hmm, this is some interesting math of yours. In fact one disk stores a little over half an hour.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pond
Until blue-ray becomes more affordable, I don’t think storing AVCHD in DVD is a good idea.
To each his own.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pond
Here is what I will do. I will use my HF10 to capture video at 1920x1080. I have a Sony HC3 (HDV 1440x1080) which can be used as a tape deck. Using a HDMI cable, can I transfer the video from HF10 at 1920x1080 to HC3 and record it at 1440x1080? If this works, then this is what I prefer but I have to sacrifice loosing some video quality.
This will not work.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pond
If HDMI cable doesn’t allow me to do this, then I will have to rely on editing software to down convert it to 1440x1080 for my HC3 to record it as tape.
To each his own.
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  #4  
Old 05-10-2008, 11:06 AM
Luc Luc is offline
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Join Date: Jun 2003
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Quote:
Originally Posted by poncho
I use tape based camcorders. I keep the tape. I make backups on external hard disk drives. I do not trust DVD's for archive.

I don't trust DVD's either. So I keep copy of DVD's on my hard-drives and make every couple of years backup of most important DVD's.

But I also found this great link (thanks to Spocko) that explains how to choose best archival DVD's:

http://adterrasperaspera.com/blog/2...-archival-media

I bought a few Taiyo Yuden DVD+R and in theory they should last at least several decades (I store them in a dark/dry place).
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